Dawes sacked

[Rockford's Love Child]

MP brought a proactive approach and gave us the energy we needed in the early years. However, I am not sure it can be claimed that he 'saved the club' financially, given his beneficial inheritance from PJ and the fact that in real terms we are actually no better off now than a decade ago, on or off the pitch.

It is probably more accurate to say PJ has saved the club on numerous occasions, regardless of how frustrating the last few years of his ownership were.

 

[O4anotherplayoff]

Think saying Mark saved the club is over-egging the pudding. He got a very good deal from PJ, who trusted him with the club’s future.

I don’t. PJ had been trying to offload the club for years but nobody credible wanted it (whereas apparently the likes of S Vaughan did) until Palios came along.

That’s years of wanting offload a debt written club, and years of under-investment in both infrastructure and personnel. It caught up with us big time, and no wonder the vultures were circling.

Of course PJ also gave us the trip to the moon, and I doubt many of our fan base would change that, despite it being unsustainably financed by debt and all the inevitable consequences of that. Thank goodness PJ saw fit to eventually write a chunk of it off…. under Palios. And it was PJ saved us from the disastrous Osterman, who himself had taken on ‘flogging the dead horse‘ from Gerry Gould (trust TV to capture that quote!). Others can probably go back more than 40 odd years.

If sustainable success is the benchmark, the club’s record under successive owners is hardly stellar. So, if the years of work Palios has done to change that situation - trying to make us investable to caring, generous, long term, sustainable new ownership - pays off, that‘ll be a legacy that far outweighs his mixed bag of managers and all the other criticisms he gets. And, if it doesn’t, we’ll just carry on kicking around the lower divisions under another owner who doesn’t quite have the full set of cash, acumen and care. At best. As we’ve done for most of our history.

 

[bigmart]

MP brought a proactive approach and gave us the energy we needed in the early years. However, I am not sure it can be claimed that he 'saved the club' financially, given his beneficial inheritance from PJ and the fact that in real terms we are actually no better off now than a decade ago, on or off the pitch.

It is probably more accurate to say PJ has saved the club on numerous occasions, regardless of how frustrating the last few years of his ownership were.

Even in the last couple of years PJ has helped the club financially several times and it is he that has saved the club financially, without his continued financial input I dread to think how much worse our financial position would be.

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

After a decade Palios has not, and in all probability will not, make us sustainable. We are still recording annual losses in the hundreds of thousands.

Johnson wrote off six million pounds of debt in 2014 and without that generosity the club was bust. Palios inherited a debt free club.

Palios is clearly a well intentioned owner, but it is debatable how effective his financial stewardship of the club has been.

 

[O4anotherplayoff]

Johnson’s ”generosity” was a situation forced on himself by the reckless racking up of debt under his ownership. He ultimately left himself a choice of writing off huge sums to hand it over to someone who actually gave a damn, or get a bit more from a cowboy, or let the club slide even further.

A rocket trip to the moon shouldn’t blind anyone to the fact that it simply wasn’t affordable.

Palios is a business turnaround specialist. If he‘s managed to make us investable to caring, generous, long term, sustainable new ownership - something we’ve never had in my lifetime - then that’d be quite something. If he hasn’t, then you can look forward either to many more years kicking around in the weeds or, if you’re lucky/unlucky (depending on your appetite for recklessness), another debt-fuelled boom and near-bust attempt to make it big.

 

[bigmart]

Johnson’s ”generosity” was a situation forced on himself by the reckless racking up of debt under his ownership. He ultimately left himself a choice of writing off huge sums to hand it over to someone who actually gave a damn, or get a bit more from a cowboy, or let the club slide even further.

A rocket trip to the moon shouldn’t blind anyone to the fact that it simply wasn’t affordable.

Palios is a business turnaround specialist. If he‘s managed to make us investable to caring, generous, long term, sustainable new ownership - something we’ve never had in my lifetime - then that’d be quite something. If he hasn’t, then you can look forward either to many more years kicking around in the weeds or, if you’re lucky/unlucky (depending on your appetite for recklessness), another debt-fuelled boom and near-bust attempt to make it big.

We were losing money under PJ, we are still losing money under Mark and Nicola so nothing has changed in that regard.
As for reckless racking up of debt, our promotion season from the National League was a huge gamble which if it didn't pay off end have led to a big reduction in the playing budget along with redundancies at the club.

 

[Keith Hill (Bolton)]

Even in the last couple of years PJ has helped the club financially several times and it is he that has saved the club financially, without his continued financial input I dread to think how much worse our financial position would be.

I have heard this!
And it will be interesting when the ownership changes!

 

[O4anotherplayoff]

We were losing money under PJ, we are still losing money under Mark and Nicola so nothing has changed in that regard.

That’s only part of the picture. PJ only made us investible by writing off his own excesses, whereas the Paliosi have taken that on and tried to make the club investible by focusing on developing infrastructure, community engagement, new income streams, etc. Those years of work in trying to make us investible have started becoming apparent in the balance sheet but not so much (yet) in day to day trading results.

To achieve the ultimate goal of self sustainability on Palios’ watch requires external investors to come on board too, that’s no secret. But if, as is being suggested in some quarters, his plan now is to sell up, then we’ll have to hope that all the work done so far has made the club viable enough to attract a sustainable future under a caring, generous, long term new owner.

As for reckless racking up of debt, our promotion season from the National League was a huge gamble which if it didn't pay off end have led to a big reduction in the playing budget along with redundancies at the club.

That wasn’t reckless racking up of debt or a huge gamble, but the financing behind it (mainly proceeds of Ingleborough) was certainly being burned up.

 

[Ian]

There was a lot of dodgy dealings going on during the PJ era. Frank Corfe being one of them. No wonder they had massive debt, although I must say we came so close to the promised land on a few occasions. Something that seems light years away now. The way I look at it, MP has come in and fair play to him for doing that and he's tried to stabalise the club and do what he does best. However I feel the club doesn't really have an identity now. It's almost soulless but that was probably happening way before MP stepped in when the rot had well and truly started to set.

 

[Ian]

 

[bigmart]

Decent interview, honest and realises a lot of hard work is required

 

[O4anotherplayoff]

Very upbeat but still realistic, as you’d expect from him.

I wish they’d asked him about his involvement in choosing the next manager. But, for any number of reasons, I’m not surprised they didn’t.

 

[bigmart]

Looks like Saunders Norris and O'Connor are all training and could be a couple of trialists training with us

 

[Sparky]

Together Everyone Achieves More!

Hope they have that printed in the changing rooms!

Nigel mentions it won’t happen overnight and it’s a project so my guess is that unless results continue on a negative run that he’ll be around for a good while yet, perhaps until the end of the season? Who knows. He talks a good game of course but it’s results that matter. Hopefully a more back to basics approach and none of the square pegs in round holes we’ve seen

 

[Ian]

I think we will at least see some structured football in the next few weeks. I'm sure we'll lose a few too but if we can just get back into games, make them competitive affairs, give the fans something to cheer about then we can turn a corner. As we've said, the players aren't bad at all, we just need to give them some direction and confidence to go out there and perform.

 

[Keith Hill (Bolton)]

Together Everyone Achieves More!

Hope they have that printed in the changing rooms!

Nigel mentions it won’t happen overnight and it’s a project so my guess is that unless results continue on a negative run that he’ll be around for a good while yet, perhaps until the end of the season? Who knows. He talks a good game of course but it’s results that matter. Hopefully a more back to basics approach and none of the square pegs in round holes we’ve seen

he is a motivational speaker!
And that is not the first or hundredth time I have heard that being a team leader myself in industry before retirement.
he came across enthusiastic, bouncing, full of beans! But it is first day! I can't believe he said he was Rovers supporter!
Mentioned no other staff changes or how long he wanted to be interim.
i do want Nigel to succeed as I do all our managers.
I think he will keep us up if he is able to be allowed to do the job!
depends on the injuries and if we can get a 'tune' from this lot!

 

[Boz]

I was impressed with Adkins' motivational speech. Hope we can translate it into decent performances on the pitch.

 

[drwhoman]

There was a lot of dodgy dealings going on during the PJ era. Frank Corfe being one of them. No wonder they had massive debt, although I must say we came so close to the promised land on a few occasions. Something that seems light years away now. The way I look at it, MP has come in and fair play to him for doing that and he's tried to stabalise the club and do what he does best. However I feel the club doesn't really have an identity now. It's almost soulless but that was probably happening way before MP stepped in when the rot had well and truly started to set.

I was interested in your comment about identity Ian. When I grew up on Merseyside each of the three local clubs had a clear identity, never mind those on the fringes like Southport and Chester, but do they all now? I went to Liverpool with fan friends in the 1960s and it was a Liverpool crowd supporting local and British players. Now it is an international team with international fans. I am not complaining. It is a fact. In my mind Club identity generally is less clear. In the 60s it was a Wirral crowd at Prenton but is it noWhat is clear that whether it was PJ, Mark, or the next person, Rovers will always struggle without an owner with money. Making a profit has not been sustainable for many years. Too little income, too many costs. The best any Manager can do is to get us toL1. The successes of 20 odd years ago were glorious but a historical anomaly.

 

[dollar'sbloke]

There has been a lot of re-writing of history here. To accuse PJ of reckless spending in his seven years when he took us to the verge of tier one, is a bold spin. From that point on, all PJ spending was in the reluctant category. The Corfe myth has no substance he went more out on a limb to retain tier two, I can't recall the anti-lobby in that cause.
After that it was all firefighting until MP arrived. Again this is all laced with misunderstanding. MP is in football terms potless and PJ knew this so hemmed him in to ensure he put in time and effort. MP has not been able to raise debt against assets in a punt to leap the club forward, which is what 99% do. It is very clear his personal dealings can only be credited with more shares. Being a TRFC shareholder is not a position of strength.
Selling the club now would mean getting a decent chunk of your own money back in a share sale and arranging it so that the new owner puts hard cash in. That asking price is no quite considerable I guess, making a sale unlikely.
Making us sustainable does not mean income matches outgoings. Historically the negative gap has been unmanageable as we hope for player sales and/or cup ties. The point is to run at a low loss which reasonably can be balanced by those occasional events.
Vitally MP has tried to expand revenue streams away from matchdays but it has seemed a one step forward and one back outcome at times. The suites are worked quite hard and must bring something in, the new tent may expand that by some way although it is the bottom line that counts not increased turnover. The concerts were amateurish and lost and the hotel was a disaster avoided.
If the tent can add quarter of a million to the budget it may kickstart things, big if though as the lead company aren't in it for nothing.

 

[Am on mobile]

Ironic he gets sacked then a few of the injured players are back in training couldnt wright it could you