League Two Rovers v Crawley

[Rockford's Love Child]

Agree with this over Jolley.

I don't think we will be prolific scorers under Micky as we have never been whilst back in the league.

That is purely because there generally have not been many goals in the squad in the Football League. We were prolific in the National League when we had Cook, Norwood, Jennings and others.

The collection of strikers we have this season is the poorest I can remember at the club for many years.

 

[bigmart]

That is purely because there generally have not been many goals in the squad in the Football League. We were prolific in the National League when we had Cook, Norwood, Jennings and others.

The collection of strikers we have this season is the poorest I can remember at the club for many years.

We had the prolific Norwood when we got promoted and also had Jennings but we weren't prolific.
We were supposed to be more risk taking this season but that's not been the case and is not Micky's style, we are usually fairly solid and that's about it. Although the strikers are not that good, the service in general is fairly lacking

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

We had the prolific Norwood when we got promoted and also had Jennings but we weren't prolific.
We were supposed to be more risk taking this season but that's not been the case and is not Micky's style, we are usually fairly solid and that's about it. Although the strikers are not that good, the service in general is fairly lacking

We did not have Cook in the Football League and Jennings was not as effective as a goalscorer at the higher level. Norwood scored 32 goals in League Two under Mellon, which slightly undermines your argument.

Our difficulty in scoring goals is nothing to do with Mellon's alleged 'negative' style and everything to do with the quality of our forwards. In the last two seasons, our forwards have been extremely poor.

Keith Hill had exactly the same trouble once James Vaughan got injured. In fact, we were even less effective in front of goal during his last months.

 

[Keith Hill (Bolton)]

The attendance figures do have to have season ticket holders into account. It's because of V.A.T.
How they get around the distance season tickets, I am not privy to this!

I sat and suffered last night, I have enjoyed kids games more. It did seem that the lads in the first half didn't know how to cope with how Crawley tested us. The good thing was that Joe was in goal, I dread to think if Hewelt was in goal. And the changes straight after half time. Emphasised the need for a different approach. It was also fortunate that the penalty nearly ended up the Vennazzi restaurant. And that Turnbull knows what to do in the penalty box.Crawley were the better team on the night!

We were awful as a team, shape, tactics, passing, passion and lacking in skill, know-how and the basics!
I've said it before and I'll repeat it again, this squad is nowhere near good enough to go up or even challenge for the play offs. Maybe, just maybe, it wasn't the pulling power of Crawley or the weather that only or close to under 5K turned up.

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

The attendance figures do have to have season ticket holders into account. It's because of V.A.T.

That is not true.

 

[Boz]

Crawley had a very fluid set up from the off, which prevented the full backs getting forward. There was still confusion in the ranks in the second half, especially after the changes, Bristow backed off an advancing player even though he was the only one able to challenge as he searched for his dedicated man further advanced.

I keep reading about Mellon's dull style and yet I haven't seen a single style this season comparatively better. Tier 4 is about effort and attrition. The key problem in the second victory is a team that creates few clear cut chances now looks completely unable to take them. What might become a chance gets Saunders first touch and ceases to exist. Burton at times looks at a loss as what to do, Saunders has no doubts but little ability. In an age when fans convince themselves about players via Stats without even watching them, possibly some focus on the Lewis hattrick last year- this is misplaced he is a water carrier of few skills.

Hemmings is desperately needed and Saunders is too Nevitt like to work well with him. Mumbungo and Saunders would have been a better bet last night. T-C did the Morris role very well on Saturday his complete absence last night was baffling, Judith is in a different country most of the time.

You could play Merrie, O'Connor, Walker and Hendry across the midfield let the full backs drive with abandon. Hawkes could come on later. Last night the worries about up front confused the middle set up and it could have been fatal.

Bottom line, 6 points great, derived from a surging one-two by Turnbull and a drive into the box by O'Connor file under non-viable long term.

You seem to have some very polarised opinions about players, whereas I would suggest that we've a typical L2 squad, with most players having strengths and weaknesses. I disagree that Mumbongo offers anything special and felt that the Saunders-Hemmings pairing was showing promise before Kane's injury, with Harvey showing much greater awareness of where his strike partner was likely to be and finding him more than Nevitt could manage. With Hemmings out for a while, will have to see how best we can develop a threat up front.

 

[dollar'sbloke]

You seem to have some very polarised opinions about players, whereas I would suggest that we've a typical L2 squad, with most players having strengths and weaknesses. I disagree that Mumbongo offers anything special and felt that the Saunders-Hemmings pairing was showing promise before Kane's injury, with Harvey showing much greater awareness of where his strike partner was likely to be and finding him more than Nevitt could manage. With Hemmings out for a while, will have to see how best we can develop a threat up front.

Maybe I do in as far as players inevitably fit certain types that cannot change. Not sure I have ever suggested Mumbongo is anything special, he is however rather unique in this squad.
Hemmings is a lower league Aldo, nothing in his physical make up or skill set is notable. Unlike Aldo the whole team isn't set up for him and of course he is nowhere near as effective. But he is competent without outstanding in all parts of his game.
Saunders, Nevitt, Burton and Jolley have lots of energy and considerable pace. Nevitt traded some pace for a bit of physical presence, but like the others was eaten by average defenders in this league. None have much skill, in fact their pace normally is too much for their skill.
Mumbungo is far from impressive, but gives defenders a war and wins some of the battles. All of the above lose every battle bar silly mistakes from defenders. Mumbungo's composure in front of goal appears as poor as the other workers and bizarrely he once hinted at having great speed, which is baffling as his work off the ball looks laboured.
Glatzel of course was a different gravy, he couldn't hold the line at this level but could have been undefendable dropped off and behind Hemmings.
Glatzel was never contracted so forget him, retain Hemmings and Saunders then look for players who add something new and better. Hemmings might score 25 next season but he won't have improved, just Tranmere will have used him better, no one improves in their 30's. Saunders looks like he has no idea where he is when on the ball but a Scott Taylor was like that once. If Palios gets lucky he could have a 'Blackpool' style period and get sold off before reverting to type.
Having three Saunders types means the subs have little impact by default.

 

[Ian]

Mumbungo is far from impressive, but gives defenders a war and wins some of the battles.

Not a chance. Frustratingly he does not use any of his physical presence often choosing to run instead of fight. He is easy for defenders.

 

[bigmart]

Not a chance. Frustratingly he does not use any of his physical presence often choosing to run instead of fight. He is easy for defenders.

For all his physical presence he rarely uses it to any effect

 

[mellow submarine]

That is not true.

Maybe someone from the club can clear this one up.

 

[dollar'sbloke]

Not a chance. Frustratingly he does not use any of his physical presence often choosing to run instead of fight. He is easy for defenders.

The mere fact he became the long ball target allowed Hemmings to seek the second ball. Pretty sure defenders would credit him with giving them a far harder time than the alternatives. Probably not a full solution but was a step in the right direction.

 

[Keith Hill (Bolton)]

That is not true.

I have just googled it.
The mail, the guardian, the telegraph in separate columns are agreed that as quoted, VAT is paid for all tickets sold, and attendance figures are based on tickets sold, not bums on seats, which includes season tickets and reduced prices.

Hope it clears that up!

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

I have just googled it.
The mail, the guardian, the telegraph in separate columns are agreed that as quoted, VAT is paid for all tickets sold, and attendance figures are based on tickets sold, not bums on seats, which includes season tickets and reduced prices.

Hope it clears that up!

It does not clear up anything.

For a start, different clubs treat attendance figures differently. Clubs like Arsenal and United who have massive stadiums and advanced ticketing systems and sell out virtually every game, will often include non-attending season ticket holders in the gate, whereas many lower division clubs won't.

HMRC don't use the published attendance figure to determine the VAT due, so VAT is irrelevant.

 

[Boz]

The mere fact he became the long ball target allowed Hemmings to seek the second ball. Pretty sure defenders would credit him with giving them a far harder time than the alternatives. Probably not a full solution but was a step in the right direction.

Unsure using him as a decoy to create space for his striking partner has as much value when Hemmings not around. He frustrates by not making use of his physique, Burton arguably offers more aerial threat. If Umerah does play for Pools this weekend we’ll see a forward of similar limited talent who’s better at making an impact. Defenders may find it harder to deal with the Saunders Duracell bunny style than a player who’s statuesque. There was one of the recent home games Orient/Salford, where he came on as a sub and played well, holding up the ball and picking up a free-kick, but that seemed to be an exception

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

The reality is we are woefully short in the centre forward positions and Mumbongo and possibly Burton won't be here next season.

 

[Ian]

Yes, we just have to manage as best as possible until the end of the season. We could still be in this position next season although I would hope not! Do a lot of the contracts end this season? I think we still have Hemmings for another season but what about the likes of Lewis and some of the youngsters?

 

[Keith Hill (Bolton)]

It does not clear up anything.

For a start, different clubs treat attendance figures differently. Clubs like Arsenal and United who have massive stadiums and advanced ticketing systems and sell out virtually every game, will often include non-attending season ticket holders in the gate, whereas many lower division clubs won't.

HMRC don't use the published attendance figure to determine the VAT due, so VAT is irrelevant.

How can VAT be irrelevant?
When it is imposed on clubs? Club's cannot get away with fiddling the figures due to it being illegal.
if they didn't include all tickets sold including season tickets, how can they work out the VAT? And it would be fraud!

I will ask one of the guys on Saturday!

But Google it! I did!

 

[dollar'sbloke]

The reality is we are woefully short in the centre forward positions and Mumbongo and possibly Burton won't be here next season.

Probably and the Jolley extension was premature in the extreme. The concern is Palios is living under great delusion now. Hardly anyone mourned the departure of Doohan, least of all me, the gross profit of £100,000 was somewhat extraordinary. Do they now think all these other young signings will now reap transfer fees after so many abject failures before them?
Bristow may well attract a fee, but I am sure his career will be limited, another two calamitous moments the other night. Balance that with the rest, Hockenhull's first year is now consigned to Warrington so getting a fee there will be a Lazarus style revival.
The first team must be the best team not a showroom for the not great, despite the odd financial success. Joe is swiftly exposing a bad decision made a year ago.

 

[Ian]

The concern is Palios is living under great delusion now. Hardly anyone mourned the departure of Doohan, least of all me, the gross profit of £100,000 was somewhat extraordinary. Do they now think all these other young signings will now reap transfer fees after so many abject failures before them?

I don't think he's delusional, I just think he's trying to create a model with very limited resources. IMO the football will suffer but we still have a club to go to on a Sat afternoon.

 

[dollar'sbloke]

How can VAT be irrelevant?
When it is imposed on clubs? Club's cannot get away with fiddling the figures due to it being illegal.
if they didn't include all tickets sold including season tickets, how can they work out the VAT? And it would be fraud!

I will ask one of the guys on Saturday!

But Google it! I did!

Really cannot see how this matters but VAT is an accountancy issue and the gate measure is primarily a safety issue in as far as the limit isn't exceeded. The latter is about as concerning as the topic is important. Last time I went in, long time ago, there was a counter for each stand but now everyone has a pre-bought ticket by months or minutes. They certainly can't let it fill up completely with tickets yet to be used- hardly a worry until.....when??? lol