Rovers v Brentford

[Boz]

With our small, injury-depleted squad this is a difficult time for a hard game against one of the moneybags sides in L1. Last season we drew 1-1, a 94th minute equaliser from the visitors, which was probably fair.

Assuming Goodi's fit (and there were encouraging noises about that) it seems likely that we'll start with the same XI as v Stevenage. I have some doubts about replacing Taylor with Dugdale, not because Adam isn't perfectly capable, but all the indications are he wants and will ultimately return to Crewe. While section's of the crowd have been on Ash's back, if he's not playing, he can't find his way back to form (tbh he's not done that badly anyway). Brentford fans feel that Rosler sets them up too defensively on their travels and that could give us a hope.

Prediction. While there'll be more travelling fans than v Stevenage, home support unchanged giving a crowd of about 4.3k. Just can't see us getting anything from this one.

 

[bigmart]

Only Fon & Baggie return think we will be outplayed in midfield and lose 1 0

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

If nothing else, it should be an open and entertaining game as Brentford will come here and have a go at us rather than sitting back. Obviously the Bees are strong favourites but if our gradual improvement of recent games continues, who knows. Regardless of the opposition, we need to get a home win sooner rather than later.

I am happy for any of the three centre backs to play together, my only concern being Goodison's fitmess if he is asked to play every game: ironically, despite the jeers of a minority last week (greatly exaggerated in the media I think) Ash Taylor had been our most reliable defender this season prior to Goody's return. A couple of defenders have been on trial this week, so I don't think RM is looking at Dugdale as a long term solution.

 

[Boz]

Actually I'd forgotten about OFW returning. Despite his poor game v Fleetwood, he's likely to reclaim the goalie shirt.

I agree with RLC that Dugdale isn't seen as the long-term solution. In the short-term, I'm happy for him to cover for an ageing Goodi, but allowing him to regain fitness playing while Ash Taylor is benched doesn't seem so clearly in our best interests, given he'll be going back to Crewe

 

[bring back the cowshed!]

This is a match we'll do well to win. The defence doesn't leak any more, so it will be close. But apart from the Crawley game, we haven't managed more than one goal. Without the creativity in midfield, where will the chances come from? I think 1-1 is the likely score.

 

[Ian]

Yeah, Ash hasn't been bad this season, well not defensively anyway. I wish he would leave distribution to someone else though. I don't care who's in defence as long as Goody is playing beside them.

I think RLC is right in saying it should be an entertaining game. Good team Brentford and unfortunately. I think we'll lose. Simply because we cannot create anything with the current team and we won't be able to hold out defensively.

On a side note, saw this regarding Brentford.
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/brentford-fc-vs-shrewsbury-pay-what-can-1-1654797

 

[bring back the cowshed!]

On a side note, saw this regarding Brentford.
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/brentford-fc-vs-shrewsbury-pay-what-can-1-1654797

Interesting. Asking home supporters to pay what they want to attend a game is novel and was so successful last season that Brentford are repeating it for another game this year. I'm not sure I'd be impressed if I was a season ticket holder, but that apart it might be a good tactic to boost the crowd when the team are having a bad spell and are playing a team with strong away support.

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

Absolutely gutted that we did not take anything from the game today. After a diabolical first twenty minutes, we were the better side for long spells and deserved at least a point. Some of our football was very good, we were a constant attacking threat and we showed great spirit. But you can't give one of the top sides a two goal start in the manner that we did.

In the first quarter of an hour I thought we were outmuscled as much as outplayed: our centre halves were dominated by their strikers and the lack of a player in midfield who can tackle and help relieve pressure was an obvious problem again. The tactic in this early spell of hoofing long balls to Lowe and Akpro was daft against their huge centre backs. However, after their second goal we settled and played some very good stuff, with all of the midfield trio in particular doing well and Max my man of the match. Horwood put some great balls into the box, which frustratingly we failed to attack, and Akpro was very lively.

We deserved to level at 2-2 after half time, but we then had a ten minute spell where we allowed the tempo to drop, sat too deep and let them them back into the game, which resulted in their third goal. I don't think Fonners had his best game today, and was possibly at fault for both the first and third goals.

The penalty decision was harsh: the ball definitely hit Dugdale's hand, but it looked like it deflected off his thigh onto his arm and I am not sure he could get out of the way of it. The cruellest imaginable ending to the game.

The football we played today was probably the best of the season so far, but we now desperately need wins from the matches against 'lesser' opposition coming up.

 

[Ian]

The first 15 minutes cost us dearly. We were awful and at 2-0 down, I thought we were in for a real nightmare. Credit to the team for bouncing back and we played so much better after the first goal. However the same old problems still continue to haunt us. Defence is still poor. Midfield isn't strong enough. Lowe isn't in the game enough. He works well and is generally good with the ball but this is miles from where we need him.

I was pleased to see Stockton get a goal with a real good finish. Again, he's done well when he's been called on. Maybe he needs to be involved more. Disappointed with the penalty, looked harsh to me and the first goal should never have came because Powers challenge was a good one, never a free kick.

We were so poor in the first 15, Brentford could have had 4. As well as scoring two, they hit the post and the crossbar.
Fon Williams was poor as well. Continually arguing between defence, not coming off his line, poor kicking and poor handling.

Sadly, key players still missing. Robinson crocked again, Koumas still out and Wallace still struggling. Ronnie has to do something with the defence.

 

[Boz]

Poor start from Rovers, letting the visitors take an early lead from a dubious free-kick after OFW stayed glued to his goal-line and failed to claim the ball and then double it despite ample opportunity to clear the lines. For a spell from mid-way through the first half until just after the equaliser we played really well and deserved to be level, but then were pushed back and gave Brentford a free header to restore the lead. Despite Cole's clinical leveller, the referee who had been one of the most inept seen at PP recently, awarded a distinctly dodgy penalty to allow the visitors to run off with all the points.

Of the defence, only Horwood had a steady game, probably my MOM. While the opposition forwards were awkward customers, they still could have handled things better. I don't get Dugdale being selected ahead of Taylor and he was ropey today when put under any pressure. Atkinson and Power had good games in midfield, Lowe and Akpa Akpro worked hard up front. Getting nothing from this one means that we need some results to steady the ship.

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

I agree that Taylor should start alongside Goodison (who was not great today it should be said) but until we can find someone who can win the ball in midfield we will have problems. Swapping personnel in the back four is not going to make us defend any better as a team, which I think was as much of a problem today (for the first 20 minutes at least) as in previous matches.

 

[bigmart]

We were appalling at the start and I feared a right hammering again, but we did improve and got back into the game, but you could see their 3rd goal coming as they were dominant at this stage. Thought we had got a good draw only for us to be cruelly denied by a debatable decision at the end.

Defence was very poor early on and had a tough time all game, Horwood is good going forward and is very good crossing but is fairly weak defensivly, nobody in the midfield can tackle which isn't helping things.

I would start Stockton & Akpa Akpro up font as I don't think Lowe is upto it anymore, for me he didn't do anything yesterday.

 

[bigmart]

Just too add if we are relying on Koumas or Robinson to help us up the table we are going to be in trouble as they are both going to struggle with injuries all season.

 

[Boz]

I agree that Taylor should start alongside Goodison (who was not great today it should be said) but until we can find someone who can win the ball in midfield we will have problems. Swapping personnel in the back four is not going to make us defend any better as a team, which I think was as much of a problem today (for the first 20 minutes at least) as in previous matches.

I've been banging on about the need for a defensive midfielder a while. However I'm not sure how big a factor it was yesterday. All of their goals could be attributed to some form of defensive error, so while protecting the back four helps, they were all, excepting the penalty, fairly routine tasks for defenders. Ironically the goal where a ball-winning midfielder might have made a difference was the one Atkinson scored for us which was passed through their middle.

I agree Goodi had his worst game since returning and coupled with his hamstring problem begs the question of why we didn't start with a Dugdale-Taylor pairing. Ronnie seems to accept that Goodison can't start every game, yet picks him for them all since Foster's departure.

With regard to Lowe, if we give him the opportunities, he'll usually test the keeper at least. In some ways his work-rate counts against him, as a lazy player might not go looking for the ball so much but then be in a better position when balls are pinged into the area.

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

I don't think there is any way Lowe is past it, I think it is simply a case of his stuttering form mirroring that of the team generally. As Ian has pointed out several times, even in the games where we have scored goals we have not been putting the balls in the right areas for him (he is still our joint top scorer after all).

Following on from Boz's comments about the defence, although errors from the back four contributed to all the goals yesterday, the way Brentford camped out in our half of the field in the first twenty minutes yesterday and used our goal for shooting practice does suggest an imbalance in the midfield. I thought we were outmuscled in the middle of the pitch and we did not have anybody who could put in a tackle to stem the tide: there is no way a team playing at home should be penned back on the edge of their own 18 yard box in the first 20 minutes in the way that we were.

Regarding the back four individually, in the majority of games at least three of the back four have not performed. I think Ronnie knew that Horwood was not great defensively but gambled on the three playing alongside him being solid, which they have not been. Given that we have not got the resources to bring in three more defenders long term, we have to hope that the form of Holmes / Taylor / Goodison improves or we are going to be in trouble.

 

[Ian]

Going back to what bigmart was saying about Horwood going forward, it's frustrating now many crosses we put into the box that get cleared away. Not sure if its the quality of cross or just not having enough height in the box.

It's just not working for Lowe right now. In a good team, who can create chances he would score goals. How many really good opportunities does he get to score per game? Yesterday he spend all game chasing the keeper down and playing well outside the box, passing, linking up play, whereas really we need him to be in the box where poaches perform best.

His work rate is really good, but he's not going to get 10 goals in this team nevermind 20!

Goody is a one off, but the reason he's playing is because the form our defenders have been in. At the start of the season, I'm sure Ronnie had it in mind that he would use Goody when needed. If injuries or suspensions took their toll. Never did he plan to be using him every game. It is worrying that this is the case. You really shouldn't be relying on a 40-year old to hold up the defence all season. Is nobody else able to cut it?

Should we also be looking at Mooney to make a few more starts as OFW seems shaky at the moment.

 

[roverstillidie]

I don't understand why Ronnie keeps saying its "individual mistakes" in the back four that's causing problems. From my perspective it's clear that we can't defend as a team. From the front backwards we don't defend as a unit. The midfield is hopeless at cutting out any attacks, and the strikers don't seem to put much pressure on the oppositions back 4 when they have the ball. When other teams attack it often seems to be 6/7/8 v 4. Unless Ronnie realises that the problem is the team defending as an overall unit (hence the problem with set pieces), we're going to continue to leak goals left, right and centre. Conceding 9 goals at home in 3 league games is simply not good enough.

 

[Rockford's Love Child]

I don't understand why Ronnie keeps saying its "individual mistakes" in the back four that's causing problems. From my perspective it's clear that we can't defend as a team. From the front backwards we don't defend as a unit. The midfield is hopeless at cutting out any attacks, and the strikers don't seem to put much pressure on the oppositions back 4 when they have the ball. When other teams attack it often seems to be 6/7/8 v 4. Unless Ronnie realises that the problem is the team defending as an overall unit (hence the problem with set pieces), we're going to continue to leak goals left, right and centre. Conceding 9 goals at home in 3 league games is simply not good enough.

Agreed.