• Nigel Adkins has been given the Tranmere job on a permanent basis signing until the end of the 25/26 season. Continue the discussion here.

Rovers 0 - 3 Brentford

Rob

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Clint Hill
Worst 93 minutes of football I have seen in my life.

Discuss?
 

DIW

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Goodison
Useless Muppets 0 Brentford 3

Player assessment for today's erm... 'performance'

Gulasci - less than convincing
Darville - slow and frequently out of position
Goodison - must be wondering what he did to deserve this
Wootton - nowhere near the performance of the Brighton game
Cresswell - well below par, some appalling deliveries today
Mclaren - my god where do you start, so inept it's staggering
Mendy - played like Eeyore
Welsh - battled about to no effect really, at least he wanted it
Jennings - looked dangerous when they got him the ball, problem was they were hoofing it to the other side most of the time
Akins - won a few headers, that was all
Enoch - tried hard, starved of service, felt a bit sorry for him.

Les - wandered about in the technical (there's irony for you!) area looking like a kind old Grandad but at no point convincing anyone he was a manager of a football team. Tactics for today seemed to be to hit it to Akins head and then see what happens. Scarily clueless.

Relegation looms - no doubt about it.
 

SonkORLY?

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Eddy Sonko
That's harsh on Cressa - his delivery from set pieces was poor but he also put in 4 or 5 brilliant crosses from open-play, certainly more good deliveries than bad. Also Wooton did alright, better than Goodison. Gulasci did nothing wrong. It was a very poor performance but try to maintain a sense of perspective. Analysing individual performances largely misses the point of our problems. No excuses for this performance or result though - simply unacceptable.

"Supporters" pathetic as per.

Mclaren was poor but IMO no worse than Mendy for example, so felt a bit sorry for him (or any player) going off to that tirade of abuse. Not sure what Blanchard did to deserve being dropped for the less convincing Darville, nor am I sure what McLaren did to deserve a recall given Les' indirect criticism of him last week. Think Fraughan needs to play from the start more often, either in central midfield as a replacement for the injured Labadie, or out on the right for Akins. Without Labadie and ITM our starting XI doesn't have the required quality to stay in this division, quite simple. Looking forward to their return as we progress towards the end of the year - don't forget about Taylor, Broomes and Mahon, too.

Still think we'll at least still be in the fight on the last day of the season. As long as we can keep in touch with those around us until we get our best players back, we should be ok.
 

Ian

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Worst 93 minutes of football I have seen in my life.
Yep, pretty much.

Relegation looms - no doubt about it.
Yeah, this is not going to come as a complete revelation, but if we don't change things soon, we will be going down.

And when I say change things, I mean the setup, the tactics, the players, the attitude. It all stinks.

That was a shambles. We got beat 3-0 by the bottom of the league team. If we can't compete against these sides, and let's be honest, Brentford weren't up to much, then we have little chance of survival.

Les said these were the games we must be winning and Creswell said before the game, "this is a must win game". Wow. How can you have any hope of winning playing like that?! Embarrassing and awful.

Ohh, and bring back Bakayogo. One of our performers last season, he's been warming the bench for months. What are you playing at Les? Even if it to sit further up on the left ahead of Cresswell. Let's play with some god damn width instead of this ludicrous 433.
 

DIW

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Goodison
That's harsh on Cressa - his delivery from set pieces was poor but he also put in 4 or 5 brilliant crosses from open-play, certainly more good deliveries than bad. Also Wooton did alright, better than Goodison. Gulasci did nothing wrong. It was a very poor performance but try to maintain a sense of perspective. Analysing individual performances largely misses the point of our problems. No excuses for this performance or result though - simply unacceptable.

"Supporters" pathetic as per.

Mclaren was poor but IMO no worse than Mendy for example, so felt a bit sorry for him (or any player) going off to that tirade of abuse. Not sure what Blanchard did to deserve being dropped for the less convincing Darville, nor am I sure what McLaren did to deserve a recall given Les' indirect criticism of him last week. Think Fraughan needs to play from the start more often, either in central midfield as a replacement for the injured Labadie, or out on the right for Akins. Without Labadie and ITM our starting XI doesn't have the required quality to stay in this division, quite simple. Looking forward to their return as we progress towards the end of the year - don't forget about Taylor, Broomes and Mahon, too.

Still think we'll at least still be in the fight on the last day of the season. As long as we can keep in touch with those around us until we get our best players back, we should be ok.

I'll come back at you on a few points.

Cressa has played much better this season and I stand by my point that his crossing was not up to standard. He did put in a couple of good balls, but there's little point when they miss the one man in the box.

Wootton wasn't really bad, but nothing like as assured as against Brighton - I stand by that totally as well.

Gulasci did nothing wrong? How about the complete lack of communication between him and the defence or did you not see the bollocking that Goodison was handing out to him on more than 1 occasion?

It was hardly an analysis of individual performances, more a brief assessment. However I'd say that if you have that many inept individual performances then surely that is the root of the problem. Those players can play better. Those players are better? Why did they perform so badly?

I agree the support was pathetic. I also agree that McLaren (and I'm no fan of his as a footballer) did not deserve the cheers on leaving the field. That was out of order, and Mendy was just as bad.

I know we have a few players returning, but am very concerned we'll be well adrift by then.
 

SonkORLY?

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Eddy Sonko
Ohh, and bring back Bakayogo. One of our performers last season, he's been warming the bench for months. What are you playing at Les? Even if it to sit further up on the left ahead of Cresswell. Let's play with some god damn width instead of this ludicrous 433.

We play with much more width now in fairness, the current system is quite different to the one we started the season with purely in that we're now playing with outside fowards (Jenno, Akins) rather inside forwards (Gornell, ITM). Bakayogo will stay out of the team so long as Cressa and Jenno are fit, and rightly so based on current form.

He did put in a couple of good balls, but there's little point when they miss the one man in the box.

How's that his fault? You're right though, we need to utilise the extra man in centre midfield in those situations - at least one of Mendy, Welsh or Mclaren should be arriving in the box as/before the cross is being played, in addition to Enoch and the forward on the opposite flank.
 
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Jason Koumas / John Morrissey
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While agreeing with DIW that virtually every player bar Jennings had a shocker today, I take Sonko's point that our problems run deeper than a few below par individual performances.

I have tried to remain positive after previous defeats, but today we were soundly beaten by what was in my view an extremely poor Brentford side. The lack of quality of most of our fringe players is quite terrifying. I haven't seen anything from Mendy, Akins, Morrow or Wootton that suggeests they can perform consistently at this level. I am not suggesting that they don't have ability as individuals, but coping with the cut and thrust of League One at their tender ages seems to be beyond them at the moment.

Add to that our tactical ineptitude (this is not intended as a tirade against Les), and you have got serious problems. I think Les just has to realise that the same formation and approach can not be equally effective in every game regardless of the opposition. Brighton at home is not the same as Brentford at home. At times in the first half we were so deep, McLaren was virtually on Goodison's toes and Enoch was sometimes twenty yards inside our half, hunting for the ball and trying in vain to get things moving.

The lack of creativity of the midfield trio we had out there today is a major issue. How with McLaren, Welsh and Mendy, who are all much of a muchness in terms of their creative skills, sitting on top of the back four are we going to play with any imagination and creativity ? Playing a tight, defensive minded trio works against higher quality who are going to dominate possession, but not against the likes of Brentford.
 
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Jason Koumas / John Morrissey
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John King
Ohh, and bring back Bakayogo. One of our performers last season, he's been warming the bench for months. What are you playing at Les? Even if it to sit further up on the left ahead of Cresswell. Let's play with some god damn width instead of this ludicrous 433.

We could bring Bakayogo in by switching to 4-4-2 and playing Jennings up front with Enoch, with Zoom ahead of Cresswell on the left (or vice versa).

Bakayogo is one of the best players at the club, and there is too much crap out on the pitch at present to waste him warming the bench.
 
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A fine line

Have to agree with Sonko on much of what he says, there is little point in judging the team players individually, particularly the younger ones - do realise that this is them gaining experience and hopefully with a few returning players who have been injured competition will encourage their efforts.

I'm not a fan of McLaren but I would never jeer one of my own team nor would I react in the very sad way many of the crowd did at his substitution. That simply is not on. I wont accept any response along the lines of we pay our money and can dish it out if we feel like - thats drivel if you are a genuine supporter with the best interests of the club at heart.

Think on that in the match we had a number of chances to score in the second half which could have levelled or even put us in front. The Brentford keeper saved with his foot but if it had gone in who knows how things might have turned out. There is such a fine line at times in deciding games.
I still think we can survive and do hope Les sticks with the younger players.
 

bigmart

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Ian Muir
Bootlerover we hardly had any shots on target all game and created very little, we were beaten easily by a team who had scored 1 away goal all season and could easily have won by a bigger score, the guy losing his footing at the end of the first half and missing when only had the keeper to beat.

The tactics are simply not working at all enoch wins a header and there is nobody within 15 yards of him and they have easy possession. It will be a bit of a start if we went 4-4-2 give proper support to enoch up front.

Too many of that team simply are not good enough for that level darville mclaren mendy & akins have really done nothing this season and for me dont look upto it. We are bottom of the table and deserve to be.

As for the players coming back then they may help somewhat especially talor and broomes but anyone thinking mahon will help are really clutching at straws he will rarely play for the rest of his contract.
 

DIW

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Goodison
How's that his fault? You're right though, we need to utilise the extra man in centre midfield in those situations - at least one of Mendy, Welsh or Mclaren should be arriving in the box as/before the cross is being played, in addition to Enoch and the forward on the opposite flank.

How is it not his fault? Why bother banging the ball in at all when there is no-one there to get on the end of it? You're right about getting the midfield in there, but it's never going to be any of those three as they play too deep.
 

darrens8761

darrens8761
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ITM
i think today was the worst i haveseen us play. i think les parry is way out of his depth. he and shaun did very well last season to keep us up but i just dont think he is the long term answer. john barnes had until this point last year andwe are in the same position now.

his 4-3-3 is simply not working. the long hoof to enoch or akins is easily read and easily defended. feel sorry for enoch as he has the ability to score goals but what can he do with the constant high balls. we should play it to his feet as when he has it at feet nobody can get near him.

people were slating mclaren yesterday. very very unfair. the system we play by-passes the entire midfield. so how can he, welsh or mendy be blamed for the ball being hoofed over their heads. thought blanchard did ok in previous games at right back so why bring back darville.
 

Gray

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25 Sep 2005
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Ian Goodison... who else!
Don't know what to say really. I don't blame Les, the tactics aren't that bad, it's just a complete lack of quality all over the pitch. You can play whatever system you like but if you have a bunch of players that can't string 3 passes together you're going nowhere... except down.

Jennings is quality, but you need more than one decent player in a team.

You get what you pay for at the end of the day.
 
O

OneNightInGayParis

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You get what you pay for at the end of the day.

I really don't feel I did yesterday!

The performance was almost too dismal to analyse. The stats actually show that it was a pretty even match; this was probably the case but it didn't feel like it because we were so poor. Brentford are not a good team and must have thought it was Christmas. We missed Labadie big time and need him fit again soon. Fingers crossed that this can be put down to experience and is not repeated.
 
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Goodison
Having listened to the game online, McLaren's name was mentioned about 3 times which sums up his contribution really. There's also a clear colleration between McLaren playing and Rovers not winning - it's like starting the game with 10 men.

Parry's decision to play McLaren ahead of Blanchard is bizzare, stupid and ridicoulous. Blanchard has been one of our best players this season and must be part of the team every game if we have any chance of staying up.

Speaking of staying up, this tactically retarded 4-3-3 has got to be ditched. The idea of choosing a formation is to play one that gets the best out of the players you have avaliable to you - 4-3-3 does not do this. I'm not going to go into the detail as to way 4-3-3 is useless with our team as we've all gone through it a 100 times before. I'll only make 3 points as to why 4-3-3 is a waste of time:


  • It provides no width.
  • Enoch is isolated upfront (or whoever else draws the short straw and plays upfront)
  • We can't keep possesion as the system is so rigid and relies on hoofs down the line or through the middle.
I believe that Les should do the honourable thing and step down from his position. He did a great job keeping us up last year, but he should have left it there. By taking on the job this season he's effectivley saved the bus from falling off the cliff in the Italian Job and then gone back and shoved it 10 yards further off the ledge to try again!

This season he had to bring his own players and whilst he has made some good signings (Enoch and Blanchard), other players such as Wood, Darville, Cathalina, McGurk, Akins and Morrow are clearly not up to it.

We need someone with knowledge of the lower leagues and contacts throughout lower league football, not a physio with funny programme notes. The obvious choice as manager for me is the Accrington manager John Coleman - who was interested in the job when dumber (or dumb - your own opinion really!) was sacked. However he's just signed a new 5 year contract and since the club probably can't afford a pack of paper clips at the moment that seems unrealistic now.

The Chief could even be worth having a look at - well respected within the game, loads of qualifcations and vast expierience in the lower league, I also think he was the brains behind the management team last season. However is rather shoddy departure suggests to me that PJ may have burned his bridges with him.

Parry needs to go, we someone capable of picking a decent team from the players avaliable and someone who doesn't have a fetish for 4-3-3. 10 points so far is unacceptable, if this was anyone else there would be absoultely no slack whatsoever - people keep saying we have no money, but Bournemouth and Accrington have no money yet there going ok - stop clutching at straws and accept we need a manager who can actually organise the players.

After yesterday a 1/4 of the season is gone and we have 10 points and we have faield to score in the league before 44mins so far this season - that is pathetic. On that basis we're going to go down comfortably on 40 points, change is needed now.
 

Sparky

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Chris Greenacre
Wont repeat what most have said but it was awful.

On the subject of support, I agree that the treatment of McClaren was out of order. He is past it but doesnt play badly on purpose and if Les picks him then its the decision of Les, not McClaren.

I wasnt too far a group of muppets in the Kop. First singing "we want Johnson out" - I mean, what is the point of that? PJ would love to go if he could find a buyer but being honest, who in their right mind would buy a club clearly on the down side.

Their next song was "your just a physio" - saying Les isnt up to it. Its the first time I have ever heard fans starting to turn against Les. A sign of the times in that a year in the job, and we're are at the same position was when Barnes left.

Was surprsied about ITM not playin. Les has said he his head isnt right and hasnt been for a while but on the radio on the way to the game, ITM was sayin all the transfer nonsense is in the past and he now just wants to concentrate on playin and scoring goals.

Agree with a few that if we have a fully fit squad, we'll be okay. But the fact is that every team gets injuries and its how you make up for it that is key. The back up players just arent up to it.
 

Rob

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Clint Hill
I'm not a fan of McLaren but I would never jeer one of my own team nor would I react in the very sad way many of the crowd did at his substitution. That simply is not on. I wont accept any response along the lines of we pay

.

Would you go to work, put in no effort at all and mug off all of your colleagues and customers and expect people to respect you?

The fans went easy on the players yesterday.
 

Ian

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Aldo
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Fingers crossed that this can be put down to experience and is not repeated.
I don't think we can be this naive. I hate to say it, but this wasn't the only poor performance of the season and it certainly won't be the last.

I can't see any way out this season. Les isn't prepared to change anything, he's said this numerous times and seems quite stubborn in this respect. So we go through the season playing 433 with a patched up team.

And those that say we'll be OK, really could do with waking up. It's not going to get any better.

Let's just remind ourselves of the grim facts:

  • Bottom of the league. Officially the leagues worst team.
  • Worst GD in the league of -11
  • Just 2 wins in 12 league games
  • Inability to score more than 1 goal a game (ex. dag & reg away)
  • 433
  • McLaren
  • Can't string 2 passes together
  • Hoof

Sleep well everyone :shock:
 

SonkORLY?

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Eddy Sonko
Would you go to work, put in no effort at all and mug off all of your colleagues and customers and expect people to respect you?

The fans went easy on the players yesterday.

When we're at the game, it's our place to support the team. Too many managers in the stands thinking it's their place to criticise players. That's Les' job. If you want us to improve, get behind the ****ing team.

Having listened to the game online, McLaren's name was mentioned about 3 times which sums up his contribution really. There's also a clear colleration between McLaren playing and Rovers not winning - it's like starting the game with 10 men.

Parry's decision to play McLaren ahead of Blanchard is bizzare, stupid and ridicoulous. Blanchard has been one of our best players this season and must be part of the team every game if we have any chance of staying up.

Speaking of staying up, this tactically retarded 4-3-3 has got to be ditched. The idea of choosing a formation is to play one that gets the best out of the players you have avaliable to you - 4-3-3 does not do this. I'm not going to go into the detail as to way 4-3-3 is useless with our team as we've all gone through it a 100 times before. I'll only make 3 points as to why 4-3-3 is a waste of time:


  • It provides no width.
  • Enoch is isolated upfront (or whoever else draws the short straw and plays upfront)
  • We can't keep possesion as the system is so rigid and relies on hoofs down the line or through the middle.
I believe that Les should do the honourable thing and step down from his position. He did a great job keeping us up last year, but he should have left it there. By taking on the job this season he's effectivley saved the bus from falling off the cliff in the Italian Job and then gone back and shoved it 10 yards further off the ledge to try again!

This season he had to bring his own players and whilst he has made some good signings (Enoch and Blanchard), other players such as Wood, Darville, Cathalina, McGurk, Akins and Morrow are clearly not up to it.

We need someone with knowledge of the lower leagues and contacts throughout lower league football, not a physio with funny programme notes. The obvious choice as manager for me is the Accrington manager John Coleman - who was interested in the job when dumber (or dumb - your own opinion really!) was sacked. However he's just signed a new 5 year contract and since the club probably can't afford a pack of paper clips at the moment that seems unrealistic now.

The Chief could even be worth having a look at - well respected within the game, loads of qualifcations and vast expierience in the lower league, I also think he was the brains behind the management team last season. However is rather shoddy departure suggests to me that PJ may have burned his bridges with him.

Parry needs to go, we someone capable of picking a decent team from the players avaliable and someone who doesn't have a fetish for 4-3-3. 10 points so far is unacceptable, if this was anyone else there would be absoultely no slack whatsoever - people keep saying we have no money, but Bournemouth and Accrington have no money yet there going ok - stop clutching at straws and accept we need a manager who can actually organise the players.

After yesterday a 1/4 of the season is gone and we have 10 points and we have faield to score in the league before 44mins so far this season - that is pathetic. On that basis we're going to go down comfortably on 40 points, change is needed now.

For someone who didn't go to the game, you have an awful lot to say.

Enoch is looking isolated, but your other points concerning 4-3-3 are incorrect.
 
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